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What once was
Posted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 1:24 am
by AdsBot [Google]
It has been 44 years since I stood on the banks of the Puyallup River watching Marlon Brando and Jane Fonda chant for Indian fishing rights. Yes, I was one of those fellows that elected to drop bales of straw from a nearby bridge in hopes of destroying the nets that stretched from shore to shore. This Indian protest proved to be an event that changed a way of life for many of us in the Northwest. Fellows like me saw the nets as a treat to the native runs of steelhead that would migrate up our local rivers. During that time fishing in rivers like the Green and Puyallup was second to none. The Green was rated number one worldwide and the Puyallup didn’t disappoint the average Joe trying his luck. Any given weekend you would see fisherman in their makeshift huts plunking for fish all along the banks of the Green from Kent to Auburn and fires burned in barrels all along the levee from Tacoma to Puyallup. All were cold fishermen standing and waiting for that cowbell on their pole to ring. For 7 odd years the discussions about Indian fishing rights were angry and fierce. Then came the “Bolt” decision and the rest is history. It did not take long before the rivers lost their appeal to all but the hardcore few. The fishing went from fantastic to dismal in a very short time. Those first few years of netting were devastating to the natural runs up the local rivers. Suddenly we discovered our neighbors to the west started stretching nets out for miles on the open ocean – further impacting our then week runs of fish. At about that time Howard Hanson Dam was built taking away precious habitat upstream on the Green. These factors together destroyed a once fantastic fishery. Today we now have a coalition of Indians from the local tribes and state fish biologist working together in an effort to stabilize runs and provide renewed fishing opportunities for everyone. It is sad that we could not see the adverse effects of over harvesting. It is sad that most of you were not alive to experience what once was.
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 12:21 am
by kevinb
Maybe one day we'll get it back. Someday.
Nice thread Stampie
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 7:36 am
by Derrick-k
I've fished the green for steelhead for the last 5 years and I have only caught one...
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 10:06 am
by AdsBot [Google]
kevinb wrote:Maybe one day we'll get it back. Someday.
Nice thread Stampie
It would be nice but I doubt it will happen in my lifetime. We still have some fantastic fishing in our state rivers - just not around Pugetropolis. Thanks for the kind words.
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 10:18 am
by kevinb
I wasn't aware that the Puyallup River got exposure from Jane Fonda(not a good thing)
For those not aware. Jane Fonda went to hang out with the North Vietnamese Army while they were killing American GI's. Absolutley disgusting.
I'm a history buff. Wasn't even alive then,but sure does piss me off now.
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 10:35 am
by shawn
Thanks Stampie my grandpa who is 73 years young and was born and raised here on the Kitsap Pennisula and is my normal fishing partner for Salmon has told me simalar stories of years past.About the cod holes around Tacoma and Blake Island, the Salmon runs.How clear the water was and so on for back in the late 40s and the early 50s.He said in wildest dreams the fishing wouldn't be what it is today.He agrees like alot folks do that the Judge Boldt descion ruined fishing as it was then.I'm kinda sad I wasn't alive to the fishing what it was then.But also glad that I didn't have to wittness in my lifetime what has happened.It is a dang shame.To say the least.
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 3:57 pm
by AdsBot [Google]
kevinb wrote:I wasn't aware that the Puyallup River got exposure from Jane Fonda(not a good thing)
For those not aware. Jane Fonda went to hang out with the North Vietnamese Army while they were killing American GI's. Absolutley disgusting.
I'm a history buff. Wasn't even alive then,but sure does piss me off now.
Boy, you really know how to get my juices going! The mere mention of Hanoi Jane conjures up some vivid memories best left to rest. The only comment I will make about her is that she was born and raised during a time of civil unrest and some felt it was fashionable to be politically disobedient. This incident ruined what could have been a promising career for her.
You mentioned you are a history buff. While the Indians were fighting for fishing rights names like Billy Frank and Bob Satiacum became household names. Billy was considered public enemy #1 by the state game department and Bob was the blunt end of many conversations at the dinner table. You may want to Goggle their names and learn more about them and how they help shape the “Judge Bolt Decision.”
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 4:02 pm
by AdsBot [Google]
Sorry for the large font on my last post. I tried to change it to size #6 and............! Thats what I get for screwing around!
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 4:03 pm
by kevinb
stampie wrote:kevinb wrote:I wasn't aware that the Puyallup River got exposure from Jane Fonda(not a good thing)
For those not aware. Jane Fonda went to hang out with the North Vietnamese Army while they were killing American GI's. Absolutley disgusting.
I'm a history buff. Wasn't even alive then,but sure does piss me off now.
Boy, you really know how to get my juices going! The mere mention of Hanoi Jane conjures up some vivid memories best left to rest. The only comment I will make about her is that she was born and raised during a time of civil unrest and some felt it was fashionable to be politically disobedient. This incident ruined what could have been a promising career for her.
You mentioned you are a history buff. While the Indians were fighting for fishing rights names like Billy Frank and Bob Satiacum became household names. Billy was considered public enemy #1 by the state game department and Bob was the blunt end of many conversations at the dinner table. You may want to Goggle their names and learn more about them and how they help shape the “Judge Bolt Decision.”
Thanks Stampie
I will check it out.
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 6:12 pm
by AdsBot [Google]
shawn wrote:Thanks Stampie my grandpa who is 73 years young and was born and raised here on the Kitsap Pennisula and is my normal fishing partner for Salmon has told me simalar stories of years past.About the cod holes around Tacoma and Blake Island, the Salmon runs.How clear the water was and so on for back in the late 40s and the early 50s.He said in wildest dreams the fishing wouldn't be what it is today.He agrees like alot folks do that the Judge Boldt descion ruined fishing as it was then.I'm kinda sad I wasn't alive to the fishing what it was then.But also glad that I didn't have to wittness in my lifetime what has happened.It is a dang shame.To say the least.
Shawn, Your grandpa sounds like a swell guy and I am glad you share those special moments with him. He is right about the cod holes and the abundance of fish back then but I must confess something about old guys like us. We revisit our past through rose-colored glasses. The air and water quality was much worse back then. The stench from Tacoma pulp mills filled the night air and the red glow from the dumping of slag at the Asarco Smelter could clearly be seen for miles. The industries on the Tacoma tide flats were dumping everything imaginable into the waterways without care or concern as to the damage they were doing. I can only guess on the amount of toxins I was subjected to living downwind of the smelter. The big lake east of downtown Seattle that is loved by many in this forum was nothing short of a cesspool. Treatment plants were suspect at best back then and most homes near the lake either had drain fields or dumped their waste directly into the lake. The color of the water was a brownish gray and if you got within 50 feet of the lake you would surely get swimmers itch. There were things floating in that lake that were just plain disgusting. Although I would go back to that time in a “New York minute” I am a realist and can say that most things in our environment are better today. Shawn, I also must confess that I have caught more fish in the past 20 years than I ever did in the first 40.
RE:What once was
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 8:22 pm
by Lotech Joe
Mike,
I'm afraid this topic may go WAY SOUTH. Political dis rest is our right, but this forum I think isn't the right place for belligerent debate.
I hope I linked the right post to you. Help me if you can.
RE:What once was
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:04 am
by KurtO
Stampie, I'd be delighted to cast a line out with you and a REAL conversation with you. I'll shoot you a pm next time I'm in your area.
RE:What once was
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:46 am
by cant sleep
you are so right!! You got my blood flowing I just wrote a reply,,, 5000 words or so. it was along the same terms... I lost it pushed the wrong key... What the blankety blank.... happened? well anyway... Remember Allen town along I-5 in the winter where all the plunkers used to hang out....The green is a fraction of what it was.. that river was always no-2 in the state as far as catch.. the cowlitz or the skagit were the only rivers that could beat it.. thats gone!! the state fisheries was sold for a few nickels.. now my boy wont see what i experienced. now its a joke.... another one.. what is up the the boat ramps in area 11? They are a joke also the Redondo area in the summer isnt fit.. by the time your boat is in the water,, the trip is ruined because it isnt fit to serve the public.... all the more that place is a far cry from what it was in the 60s. that dock! i dont have a clue of what thats for.............Here is another one.. where's the hood canal I saw when i was a child? Oh! here's another one! where is the bottom fishery in area 11.. (true cod) what happened to bottom fish charters with all the G,Is on it? (remember the 40ft blue boat) Did comercial boys use nets on the bottom in area 11. Hm....... is anyone addressing the issue of all the algee growth in area 11 in the summer... the top 20 foot in the water collumn. its a brown snotty stuff...... is this caused by nytro runnoff from all the green lawns. in the region??
RE:What once was
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:34 am
by cant sleep
back on the green.. i remember the total fish caught per year on the green was always over 10,000. I used to ride my bike from around steel lake and watch the steelheaders at soos creek... my pole was in my hand.. but i never could hook any... took me 5 years to catch my first steelhead........ where did all the river access go on the green?.... The same place all the beaches went on the salt.. the way of the fat cats.. sold for a couple nickels and denied for all...... its a shame.... we need more golf corses........... hey thats it!!
RE:What once was
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 2:06 am
by AdsBot [Google]
cant sleep wrote:back on the green.. i remember the total fish caught per year on the green was always over 10,000. I used to ride my bike from around steel lake and watch the steelheaders at soos creek... my pole was in my hand.. but i never could hook any... took me 5 years to catch my first steelhead........ where did all the river access go on the green?.... The same place all the beaches went on the salt.. the way of the fat cats.. sold for a couple nickels and denied for all...... its a shame.... we need more golf corses........... hey thats it!!
I feel you pain “Cant Sleep.” I have a lifetime of memories about the good old days too. I am sure a few of the young people on this forum will be jealous after I share some of my stories from time past.
I can remember when friends from Albuquerque would fly up every Labor Day weekend just to fish with me. The memories of all those double and triple-headers – it was unreal. The cry of “Fish-on” would ring out all day long. Each of us would lose count and our arms would grow tired. There were times when it was impossible to connect the release clip to the sports line because the Silvers would jerk the damn line right out of your hands. I remember one trip when my boat became a magnet for a pod of killer whales. Each morning we would return to an area that produced well the previous day and behold – the same pod of whales would come to the boat to greet us. It was a fantastic feeling fighting fish while killer whales would propose, dive under and surrounded the boat. We estimated on one trip that we caught and released at least 40 fish per rod. “Fantastico”
I can remember limiting out every morning for 14 days straight at Redondo. And at least half of the catch was kings.
I remember catching trout 5 to 9 pounds in one of our state lakes.
I remember when I could take my grandchildren to one of the local lakes on the “opener” and was assured of a limit of catchables.
Now, I am going to share something that will surely upset a few on this forum. Those memories of time past are those from the past 5 years. All these fish with the exception of the large trout caught at Rufus were caught within 50 miles of Seattle. The Redondo memories were from just last fall. And it is ironic that those kings we caught were from the Clarks Creek Hatchery. A hatchery that is now managed and operated by those same Indians that staged those fish wars long ago.
The point I am trying to make is not to brag but to show you that there are still some fantastic fishing opportunities. Although I think it is important to revisit the past and to share “what once was”, it is equally important to realize that yesterday is just yesterday. Yes, there are native runs that are in trouble but our hatcheries are making up for them. Don’t lose sleep and dwell on the past and think on what might have been but rather on what could be. I am thankful for my memories but I look forward to tomorrow and the possibilities that may come.
RE:What once was
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 9:18 am
by cant sleep
yes yes yes,,,,, your right! I think i was trying to keep it all for myself..... washington state in the 60s was a great place to be 12 years old and be on a bicyle with a fishing pole in hand. im constantly finding i have to keep myself in check.... things were different than and they are different now and always changing..... sometimes i wish things would stop so i could keep it for myself. but thats not the way it is... last summer was a outstanding year in area 11.... phenomenal in fact! and the cowlitz summer run had a 6 fish limit per day.. I'll take that.. with a big fat Booya!!!!!
RE:What once was
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 4:21 pm
by eustace
What I remember about those nets when I lived over on that side of the moutains was watching them pulling in a net. I remember as they pulled the net in they through most of the fish back in the river and those fish they through back in had the apperance of being dead for a long time. It made me wonder how long they left the nets out before harvesting. I my self am part Nez and I was ashaimed.
I am proud of how the Spokanes and the Colvilles have turned there loss into a gain for there and our economy through there insight into investing in the Lake Roosevelt RECERATIONAL fishery. If only all cultures had that insight. What the native tribe really should have done is built there own hatchery, a net gain for all.
RE:What once was
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 4:54 pm
by kuttkilla
RE:What once was
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 5:10 pm
by AdsBot [Google]
kuttkilla wrote:cant sleep wrote:back on the green...
I would never fish the Green River due to Gary Ridgeway's horrific crimes out there...it's spooky and I could never fish that river...I watched the MSNBC special today "Chasing the Devil" and have read the book by Sheriff Reichart called "Chasing the Devil" and was disgusted...could hardly read on at times...I could never fish the Green River because of what took place there years and years ago...
Where’s your sense of adventure? We won’t tell if you snag a bone or two!
RE:What once was
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 5:12 pm
by cant sleep
kk, hate to say it,, but the world isnt the same any more..... its not made for people who where there heart on there sleeves... there is too much risk..... sometimes we have to watch even thoughs we take fishing... im pretty selective of who gets in my boat or hops a ride in my vehicle... there nothing worse than being in a boat with a jerk and captain control.... after working steel for thirty years downtown,,, people can be pretty sneeky.. one really has to watch themselfs and dont give your pearls away to swine..... its not the river.. its every where.. keep fishing simple and be honest to others.. and when the going gets tough.. ya must stand up and face the challenge.. i was telling derrick i caught hundreds of steelhead up up river. the palmer area.... the river looks dif up there... bolders, fast currents and fish... i dont go up there any more.... fish on...